{"id":121,"date":"2007-10-24T15:47:10","date_gmt":"2007-10-24T15:47:10","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/seamheads.com\/blog\/chapter-four-the-position-players-in-the-hall-of-fame\/"},"modified":"2010-03-11T04:05:52","modified_gmt":"2010-03-11T04:05:52","slug":"chapter-four-the-position-players-in-the-hall-of-fame","status":"publish","type":"page","link":"https:\/\/seamheads.com\/blog\/chapter-four-the-position-players-in-the-hall-of-fame\/","title":{"rendered":"Chapter Four: The Position Players in the Hall of Fame"},"content":{"rendered":"

\"baseballsbest.jpg\"<\/a><\/p>\n

Title: <\/font> BASEBALL’S BEST: The TRUE Hall of Famers<\/strong> <\/font>
\nAuthor: <\/font> Michael Hoban, Ph.D. <\/font>
\n Formats: <\/font> PDF (ebook) | Paperback <\/font>
\n<\/font> Pages: <\/font> 223<\/font><\/p>\n

\"blank2.jpg\"<\/a><\/p>\n\n\n\n\n\n
Click cover to order book<\/em><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n
 <\/td>\n<\/tr>\n
Chapter four<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n
The Position Players in the Hall of Fame<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n<\/table>\n

In Chapter 3, I explained that we would be using the NEWS HOF Monitor to try to determine which players who are in the Hall of Fame really have the numbers to be there. <\/span>The NEWS rankings tell us which position players had the best careers according to the numbers that they put together on the field of play. <\/span>I have also listed the top 20 position players in the Hall \u00e2\u20ac\u201c all of whom obviously have <\/st1>HOF<\/st1> numbers. <\/span>The #20 top player was Joe DiMaggio who had a NEWS score of 341.<\/o><\/span><\/p>\n

The big question now becomes: Where do we set the bar to determine who does and who does not have <\/st1>HOF<\/st1> numbers? <\/span>I will examine three different scenarios and see who is included and who is not \u00e2\u20ac\u201c a benchmark of 300, 290 and 280.<\/o><\/span><\/p>\n

Hall of Fame Numbers: <\/span>NEWS <\/span>= <\/span>300 <\/o><\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

In this first case, we will set the cut-off point for \u00e2\u20ac\u0153<\/st1>HOF<\/st1> numbers\u00e2\u20ac\u009d to be a NEWS score of 300 or better. <\/span><\/o><\/span><\/p>\n

In Chapter 3, I gave the list for the top 20 position players in the Hall of Fame. <\/span>Here is the list of the next group of <\/st1>HOF<\/st1> players with NEWS scores of 315 or greater. <\/span>There are eight players in this group.<\/o><\/span><\/p>\n\n\n
NEWS (315+) <\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n<\/table>\n\n\n\n\n\n\n\n\n\n\n
Player<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\nPOS<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\nCWS<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\nCV<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\nNEWS<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n
Sam Crawford<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\nRF<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n446<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n303<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n339<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n
Carl Yastrzemski <\/strong><\/font><\/td>\nLF<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n488<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>286<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n337<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n
Paul Waner <\/strong><\/font><\/td>\nRF<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n423<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>304<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n334<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n
Reggie Jackson <\/strong><\/font><\/td>\nRF<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n444<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>296<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n333<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n
George Brett <\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n3B<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n432<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>296<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n330<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n
Arky Vaughan <\/strong><\/font><\/td>\nSS<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n356<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>308<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n320<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n
Wade Boggs <\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n3B<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n394<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>291<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n317<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n
Willie McCovey<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n1B<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n408<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>285<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n316<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n<\/table>\n

There are four outfielders and four infielders in this group. <\/span>Arky <\/st1>Vaughan<\/st1> is the second highest ranked shortstop in the Hall. <\/span>But we still have no catchers at this point.<\/o><\/span><\/p>\n

Here is the list of all the other position players in the Hall of Fame (20th<\/sup> century players) with a NEWS score of 300 or greater. <\/span>There are thirteen players on this list.<\/o><\/span><\/p>\n\n\n
NEWS (300-314) <\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n<\/table>\n\n\n\n\n\n\n\n\n\n\n\n\n\n\n\n
Player<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\nPOS<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\nCWS<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\nCV<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\nNEWS<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n
Eddie Murray<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n1B<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n437<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n273<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n314<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n
Cal Ripken Jr. <\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>SS<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n427<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>276<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n314<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n
Robin Yount<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>SS<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n423<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>278<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n314<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n
Al Kaline<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\nRF<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n443<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>268<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n312<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n
Johnny Mize<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n1B<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>339<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>296<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n307<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n
Charlie Gehringer<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>2B<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n383<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>280<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n306<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n
Paul Molitor<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>DH<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>414<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>270<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n306<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n
Fred Clarke <\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>LF<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n400<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>273<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n305<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n
Duke Snider <\/strong><\/font><\/td>\nCF<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>352<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>289<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n305<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n
Harmon Killebrew <\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n1B<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>374<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>279<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n303<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n
Billy Williams <\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>LF<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n374<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>279<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n303<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n
Luke Appling <\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>SS<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>378<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>275<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n301<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n
Yogi Berra<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>C<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>375<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>276<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n301<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n<\/table>\n

There are forty-two (42) Hall of Famers with a NEWS score of 300 or better. <\/span>As we will see later, there are a total of fifty-four (54) players with a score of 300 or better \u00e2\u20ac\u201c meaning that there are twelve players with these elite numbers who are not yet in the Hall. <\/span>Of these twelve, six were still active in 2007: Barry Bonds, Gary Sheffield, Craig Biggio, Alex Rodriguez, Frank Thomas and Ken Griffey, Jr. <\/span>We will say more about these players in subsequent chapters.<\/o><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n

The breakdown by position of these top forty-two (42) Hall of Famers is: six first basemen, five second basemen, four third basemen, five shortstops, one catcher, six center fielders, eight right fielders, six left fielders, and one designated hitter (Paul Molitor played more games as a designated hitter than he did at any one position). <\/span>As you can see, Yogi Berra is the only catcher with a NEWS score greater than 300. <\/span> <\/span><\/o><\/span><\/p>\n

Most serious fans of the game will probably recognize the majority of the names on these lists without any problem. <\/span>But a few players who played earlier in the 20th<\/sup> century may not be as familiar to some fans \u00e2\u20ac\u201c such as Sam Crawford, Arky Vaughan and Fred Clarke. <\/o><\/span><\/p>\n

So, if we were to set the bar as high as a NEWS score of 300, then only forty-two (42) of the 120 position players in the Hall (35%) would have <\/st1>HOF<\/st1> numbers. <\/span>Of course, this may be too strict a criterion.<\/o><\/span><\/p>\n

Hall of Fame Numbers: <\/span>NEWS <\/span>= <\/span>290<\/o><\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

What happens if we lower the bar somewhat to include all the players in the Hall who achieved a NEWS score of 290? <\/span>The following nine Hall of Famers have scores between 290 and 299.<\/o><\/span><\/p>\n\n\n
NEWS (290-299)<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n<\/table>\n\n\n\n\n\n\n\n\n\n\n\n
Player<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\nPOS<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\nCWS<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\nCV<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\nNEWS<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n
Dave Winfield <\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>RF<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n415<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n259<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>298<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n
Johnny Bench<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>C<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>356<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>277<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>297<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n
Roberto Clemente
\n<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n		<\/font>RF<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>377<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>269<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>296<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n
Ryne Sandberg <\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>2B<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>346<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>278<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>295<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n
Tony Gwynn <\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>RF<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>398<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>269<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>294<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n
Zack Wheat <\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>LF<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n380<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>264<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>293<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n
George Davis <\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>SS<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>398<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>255<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>291<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n
Joe Cronin<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>SS<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>333<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>275<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>290<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n
Willie Stargell<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\nLF<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>370<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>263<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>290<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n<\/table>\n

As you can see, Johnny Bench becomes the second highest ranked catcher in the Hall. <\/span><\/o><\/span><\/p>\n

Zack Wheat and George Davis may not be as well known as the others. <\/span>But I doubt that many serious fans of the game would question the <\/st1>HOF<\/st1> credentials of the players on this list.<\/o><\/span><\/p>\n

If we set the cut-off for HOF<\/st1> numbers at 290, then we would have fifty-one (51) of the 120 Hall of Famers (43%) with legitimate <\/st1>HOF<\/st1> numbers. <\/span><\/o><\/span><\/p>\n

<\/o>It is of interest to note that there are only five other players (not yet in the Hall) who had career numbers in this interval – of whom one (Manny Ramirez) was still active in 2006. <\/span>Which means a total of only sixty-eight (68) players in the 20th<\/sup> century have achieved a NEWS career score of 290.<\/o><\/span><\/p>\n

Hall of Fame Numbers: <\/span>NEWS <\/span>= <\/span>280<\/o><\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

Finally, let\u00e2\u20ac\u2122s look at what it would mean if we use a NEWS score of 280 to determine <\/st1>HOF<\/st1> numbers. <\/span>But first, consider the following note that I mentioned earlier.<\/o><\/span><\/span>
\nIn his book, WIN SHARES<\/strong>, Bill James notes that, as a rule of thumb, here is how the number of win shares in a season can be interpreted for an individual player:<\/span><\/span><\/p>\n

1. <\/span>30-40 Win Shares <\/span>= <\/span>MVP-type Season<\/o>
\n2. <\/span><\/span><\/span>20-30 Win Shares <\/span>= <\/span>All-Star Season<\/o>
\n3. <\/span><\/span><\/span>10-20 Win Shares <\/span>= <\/span>Solid Regular Player <\/o>
\n4. <\/span>0-10 Win Shares <\/span>= <\/span>Bench Player<\/span>\n<\/p>\n

Now, if you are a position player who is truly deserving of the <\/st1>HOF<\/st1>, it seems that you should have been able to average at least 25 win shares during your ten best seasons (a CV of 250). <\/span>That average would put you in the middle of \u00e2\u20ac\u0153All Star\u00e2\u20ac\u009d status for your ten best seasons \u00e2\u20ac\u201c a reasonable requirement for a Hall of Famer. <\/span>The 280 NEWS criterion is based in part on this 250 CV score \u00e2\u20ac\u201c since every Hall of Famer with a NEWS of 280 also has a CV of 250. <\/span>Of course, there are some Hall of Famers who have a CV of 250 but who do not make the 280 cut-off. <\/span>In fact, there are only eight Hall of Famers who are in the 280-289 interval.<\/o><\/span><\/p>\n\n\n
NEWS (280-289)<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n<\/table>\n\n\n\n\n\n\n\n\n\n\n
Player<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\nPOS<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\nCWS<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\nCV<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\nNEWS<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n
Rod Carew <\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>2B<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>384<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>257<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>289<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n
Harry Heilmann<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\nRF<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>356<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>267<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>289<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n
Goose Goslin<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\nLF<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>355<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>263<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>286<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n
Frank Baker<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>3B<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>301<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>280<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>285<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n
Lou Brock<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>LF<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>348<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>264<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>285<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n
Frankie Frisch<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>2B<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n366<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>256<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>284<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n
Elmer Flick<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>RF<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>291<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>280<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>283<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n
Gary Carter <\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>C<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>337<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>263<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/font>282<\/strong><\/font><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n<\/table>\n

Are we now entering territory where someone might be inclined to question the <\/st1>HOF<\/st1> credentials of one or more of these players? <\/span>You can be the judge of that. <\/span>But it is certainly fair to say that players like Harry Heilmann, Goose Goslin, Frank Baker and Elmer Flick are not as well known as many other Hall of Famers.<\/o><\/span><\/p>\n

So, there are fifty-nine (59) Hall of Famers with a NEWS score of 280 or more. <\/span>This number represents 49% of the 120 20th<\/sup> century position players in the Hall. <\/span>I would suggest that all of these players certainly have legitimate <\/st1>HOF<\/st1> numbers.<\/o><\/span><\/p>\n

There are eight other players who are not in the Hall who also fall into the 280-289 interval. <\/span>Of these, Mike Piazza, Chipper Jones and Jim Thome were still active in 2007. <\/span><\/o><\/span><\/p>\n

We will use a NEWS score of 280 or better to define Hall of Fame numbers for a position player. <\/span>At the end of 2007, there were exactly eighty-four (84) position players who have played in the 20th<\/sup> century who have a NEWS score of 280 or better (of whom fifty-nine are in the Hall of Fame and ten were still active in 2007). <\/span>We will discuss these players in subsequent chapters.<\/o><\/span><\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"

Title: BASEBALL’S BEST: The TRUE Hall of Famers Author: Michael Hoban, Ph.D. Formats: PDF (ebook) | Paperback Pages: 223 Click cover to order book   Chapter four The Position Players in the Hall of Fame In Chapter 3, I explained that we would be using the NEWS HOF Monitor to try to determine which players […]<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":18,"featured_media":0,"parent":0,"menu_order":0,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","template":"","meta":{"footnotes":""},"class_list":["post-121","page","type-page","status-publish","hentry"],"aioseo_notices":[],"aioseo_head":"\n\t\t\n\t\n\t\n\t\n\t\n\t\t\n\t\t\n\t\t\n\t\t\n\t\t\n\t\t\n\t\t\n\t\t\n\t\t\n\t\t\n\t\t\n\t\t\n\t\t\n\t\t\n\t\t\n\t\t\n\t\t\n\t\t\n\t\t\n\t\t\n\t\t\n\t\t\n\t\t\n\t\t\n\t\t\n\t\t\n\t\t\n\t\t\n\t\t\n\t\t\n\t\t\n\t\t\n\t\t\n\t\t\n\t\t\n\t\t