The Hall of Famers: The 5 Levels of Greatness – Part 3
September 12, 2011 by Michael Hoban · 2 Comments
In this article, I will present the Level 3 and Level 4 position players. There were a total of thirty-one (31) players in Levels 1 and 2 – the position players with the best careers of the 20th century. In Levels 3 and 4, we have the fifty-seven (57) next best careers of the century – twenty-five (25) in Level 3 and thirty-two (32) in Level 4.
Level 3 - Players with a CAWS score > 300 & <330
Here are the twenty-five great position players whose rank for career value in the 20th century is from #32 to #56. They each have a CAWS score of better than 300 but less than 330. This means that there are only fifty-six (56) position players since 1901 who achieved a CAWS career score of 300 or better.
All numbers include the 2010 season
Bold = Hall of Famer
CWS = Career Win Shares
CV = Core Value (sum of win shares for 10 best seasons)
CAWS = Career Assessment/Win Shares = CV + .25(CWS – CV)
* = deadball era
Player | POS. | CWS | CV | CAWS | |
32. | Craig Biggio | 2B | 428 | 294 | 328 |
33. | Frank Thomas | 1B | 400 | 301 | 326 |
34. | Arky Vaughan | SS | 356 | 308 | 320 |
35. | Wade Boggs | 3B | 394 | 291 | 317 |
36. | Willie McCovey | 1B | 408 | 285 | 316 |
37. | Manny Ramirez |
LF | 408 | 285 | 316 |
38. | Dick Allen | 1B | 342 | 304 | 314 |
39. | Eddie Murray | 1B | 437 | 273 | 314 |
40. | Cal Ripken Jr. | SS | 427 | 276 | 314 |
41. | Robin Yount | SS | 423 | 278 | 314 |
42. | Jeff Bagwell | 1B | 388 | 287 | 312 |
43. | Al Kaline | RF | 443 | 268 | 312 |
44. | Ken Griffey Jr. | CF | 383 | 278 | 304 |
45. | Johnny Mize | 1B | 339 | 296 | 307 |
46. | Charlie Gehringer | 2B | 383 | 280 | 306 |
47. | Paul Molitor | DH | 414 | 270 | 306 |
48. | Fred Clarke* | LF | 400 | 273 | 305 |
49. | Duke Snider | CF | 352 | 289 | 305 |
50. | Tim Raines | LF | 390 | 275 | 304 |
51. | Harmon Killebrew | 1B | 374 | 279 | 303 |
52. | Billy Williams | LF | 374 | 279 | 303 |
53. | Roberto Alomar | 2B | 375 | 278 | 302 |
54. | Luke Appling | SS | 378 | 275 | 301 |
55. | Yogi Berra | C | 375 | 276 | 301 |
56. | Al Simmons | LF | 375 | 276 | 301 |
The twenty-five (25) Level 3 players are interesting for a number of reasons. For one thing, seven of them are not yet in the Hall of Fame. Two are currently on the HOF ballot (2011): Jeff Bagwell and Tim Raines. Four others are not yet eligible: Craig Biggio, Frank Thomas, Manny Ramirez and Ken Griffey Jr. And one of these players becomes the highest-ranked position player of the century who has been passed over for election to the Hall of Fame: Dick Allen.
Most fans are familiar with why Dick Allen is not in the Hall. There are those who believe that he had “an attitude problem” and was a “cancer in the clubhouse.” And, of course, most of this is hearsay. Whether his exclusion is just or unjust, there is one clear fact – Dick Allen has the best career numbers of any player since 1901 who has been excluded from the Hall of Fame (with the exception of Pete Rose who has been formally banned from consideration). I have a concern that Tim Raines may also fall prey to the same fate. Let us hope not.
Level 3 also contains the first catcher to appear on the lists: Yogi Berra. Johnny Bench at a CAWS score of 297 (in Level 4) is fairly close behind. Note also that the first designated hitters with outstanding careers are in Level 3: Frank Thomas and Paul Molitor.
Only three players on this list have a core value (CV) of 300 or better: Frank Thomas, Arky Vaughan and Dick Allen. That means that for their ten best seasons, each of these players averaged better than 30 win shares per season. That is a remarkable achievement. Only thirty-one (31) position players of the 20th century have accomplished this feat.
Here is the breakdown of these top fifty-six (56) players by position: twenty-seven (27) outfielders, nine (9) first basemen, seven (7) second basemen, six (6) shortstops, four (4) third basemen, two (2) designated hitters and one (1) catcher.
This ranking also serves to give some needed recognition to some recent players who might be considered “underappreciated” as they have become (or will become) eligible for election to the Hall: Craig Biggio, Frank Thomas, Jeff Bagwell and Tim Raines.
Level 4 contains the names of the thirty-two players whose CAWS career score is 280 or better but less than 300. A score of 280 is the HOF benchmark for left fielders, right fielders, first basemen and designated hitters. Level 5 (the last level) will include the names of those players at other positions who did not reach a score of 280 but did reach the benchmark for their respective positions.
All numbers include the 2010 season
Bold = Hall of Famer
CWS = Career Win Shares
CV = Core Value (sum of win shares for 10 best seasons)
CAWS = Career Assessment/Win Shares = CV + .25(CWS – CV)
* = deadball era
Level 4 - Players with a CAWS score > 280 & <300
Player | POS. | CWS | CV | CAWS | |
57. | Chipper Jones |
3B |
382 |
271 |
299 |
58. | Mark McGwire | 1B | 342 | 283 | 298 |
59. | Dave Winfield | RF | 415 | 259 | 298 |
60. | Johnny Bench | C | 356 | 277 | 297 |
61. | Derek Jeter | SS | 301 | 264 | 273 |
62. | Roberto Clemente | RF | 377 | 269 | 296 |
63. | Ryne Sandberg | 2B | 346 | 278 | 295 |
64. | Tony Gwynn | RF | 398 | 269 | 294 |
65. | Sherry Magee* | LF | 354 | 272 | 293 |
66. | Zack Wheat* | LF | 380 | 264 | 293 |
67. | Jim Thome | 1B | 366 | 267 | 292 |
68. | George Davis* | SS | 398 | 255 | 291 |
69. | Joe Jackson* | LF | 294 | 290 | 291 |
70. | Joe Cronin | SS | 333 | 275 | 290 |
71. | Rafael Palmeiro | 1B | 387 | 257 | 290 |
72. | Willie Stargell | LF | 370 | 263 | 290 |
73. | Rod Carew | 2B | 384 | 257 | 289 |
74. | Harry Heilmann | RF | 356 | 267 | 289 |
75. | Ron Santo | 3B | 324 | 275 | 287 |
76. | Bill Dahlen* | SS | 394 | 250 | 286 |
77. | Goose Goslin | LF | 355 | 263 | 286 |
78. | Mike Piazza | C | 325 | 273 | 286 |
79. | Frank Baker* | 3B | 301 | 280 | 285 |
80. | Lou Brock | LF | 348 | 264 | 285 |
81. | Will Clark | 1B | 331 | 269 | 285 |
82. | Frankie Frisch | 2B | 366 | 256 | 284 |
83. | Bobby Abreu |
RF |
332 |
266 |
283 |
84. | Elmer Flick* | RF | 291 | 280 | 283 |
85. | Gary Carter | C | 337 | 263 | 282 |
86. | Jason Giambi | 1B | 315 | 271 | 282 |
87. | Darrell Evans | 3B | 363 | 253 | 281 |
88. | Barry Larkin | SS | 347 | 258 | 280 |
Keep in mind that all of these players have HOF numbers according to the strict and tough standards of the CAWS Career Gauge. And only one hundred sixteen (116) position players in the 20th century qualify under those standards.
Some observations:
- Note the active players (in 2010) on this list. Chipper Jones, Derek Jeter and Jim Thome may not be big surprises. But what about Bobby Abreu and Jason Giambi?
- On this list, Sherry Magee and Bill Dahlen from the deadball era have been eligible and passed over for election to the Hall of Fame.
- And only three other players on this list have been eligible for election and have so far been snubbed: Ron Santo, Will Clark and Darrell Evans.
- The three catchers on this list join Yogi Berra as the only four to achieve a CAWS career score of 280: Yogi Berra, Johnny Bench, Mike Piazza and Gary Carter. Did you think that Carter’s career numbers would rank him that high among the catchers?
- These numbers indicate that Chipper Jones is the third baseman with the #5 best career numbers in the century and Derek Jeter is the #7 best shortstop.
Levels 1 through 4 contain the names of the eighty-eight (88) position players (since 1901) with the highest CAWS career scores (280 or better) – that is, the best career numbers. But there are one hundred sixteen (116) position players who posted Hall of Fame numbers during this time frame. So, who are the other twenty-eight (28)?
In Part 4 of this series, we will look at Level 5 (the last level) and that list will contain the names of those twenty-eight (28) players who did not reach a CAWS score of 280 but did post HOF numbers according to the benchmark for their position. In Part 4, I will also list the names of the forty-seven (47) major league position players who are currently in the Hall of Fame but who do not have the career numbers to be there according to the CAWS Career Gauge.
Thanks for your time.
Mike Hoban
Professor Emeritus – City U of NY
Author of A GOOD CAWS: A Hall of Fame Handbook (2011)
http://booklocker.com/books/2968.html
Interesting notes:
As a Brewers fan, I have to say that it really pains me to hear people discount Robin Yount as one of the 5 best SS of all-time. Particularly because I think he and Ripken are very comparable, and I believe Yount to have had a better career than Jeter (though only marginally, and I’m actually willing to be persuaded of otherwise on that one once Jeter’s career is over). Anyway, seeing him tied with Ripken up there is really great.
Also, regarding Yount, Ripken and Murray. Since they’re all tied up there at the same CAWS score, I thought I’d mention this – they’re also numbers 1, 2, and 3 on the career Sac Fly list. That has nothing to do with anything, but they’re kind of linked in my mind because of that odd fact, and because they were fairly contemporary players to one another. And here they are, intersecting once again.
It’s nice to see the catchers showing up. One thing I’ve been wondering all along this process reading these lists is if we should be giving catchers some sort of additional “bonus,” because their position is so demanding. Obviously, we wouldn’t do that for Win Shares in general (which already take position into account), but it would be interesting for the purposes of comparing their CAREERS, as playing catcher causes much, much more wear-and-tear. Basically, I find it odd that we haven’t really seen any until now. It doesn’t strike me as right. I know it’s just a framework, but that’s one thing I’ve found interesting about the whole exercise.
David,
At the end of 2010, these were the top shortstops of the century:
1.Honus Wagner (1897-1917) 655 422 480
2.Alex Rodriguez (1994- ) 443 329 358
3.Arky Vaughan (1932-1948) 356 308 320
4.Robin Yount (1974-1993) 423 278 314
5.Cal Ripken Jr (1981-2001) 427 276 314
6.Luke Appling (1930-1950) 378 275 301
7.Derek Jeter (1995- ) 368 273 297
So, Robin Yount is right up there tied for 4th place.
And I am sure that you are aware that catchers and shortstops share the same CAWS becnhmark for HOF numbers (250).
Thanks for your comments.
Mike